FAMILY RESEARCH RESULTS

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FAMILY RESEARCH RESULTS

Postby samuel » Wed Jun 22, 2011 8:35 pm

Hello everybody,
Just thought I would update you with the results about trying to trace my late father and uncle, who were in orphanges in the 1920's.

You have been a great help, as I live in the UK and was not familiar with the Industrial School System,I took Sinead's advice and e-mailed the Christian Brothers Archives, they were very helpful ,I sent them death records for my father and uncle, and they came back to me straight away.

My father and uncle were admitted to the Carriglea Industrial School in 1924 by order of the courts, they were found wandering around Dublin with no means to support themselves they were 12 and 7 years of age, they were originally from Cavan and Longford. but they had moved to Dublin at some point. Their mother, my Grandmother was seriously ill in the Dublin Union, and sadly she passed away in there, and I suppose my Grandfather could not cope. They had to stay there until they were 16years of age.

At least I now know why my father was reluctant to talk about his childhood.

Regards,
Pat.
samuel
 

Re: FAMILY RESEARCH RESULTS

Postby Enviro500 » Wed Jun 22, 2011 9:41 pm

Samuel.
I am happy for you and your history is put to bed. It was tough times in the 1920s at home. Curiously my Great Grandad was gardener at Carriglea for sometime and one day he found a Christian Bro, savagely beating a child.. He but down his barrow and remonstrated with the guy who tried to become physical with Great Grandad.. My Grand promptly flattened the guy and the child was rescued at the cost of my Great Grandads job. He was dismissed immediately...the result was he ended up going to England to work and support his family in Sallynoggin...SO MUCH FOR THE CHRISTIAN BROTHERHOOOD...It took another seventy years for the real truth to out about these 'CHRISTIANS' !!

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Re: FAMILY RESEARCH RESULTS

Postby Sinead » Wed Jun 22, 2011 9:52 pm

Samuel:

Delighted the Brothers were of help to you. Many children, of all persuasions, lived in homes because of the their mother's death, illness or inability to cope. Ireland of the late 1800's and early 1900's was a hard place for a single parent women usually fared better than men. The women could find work in 'the big houses' and could take the young children with them. The men, had not been involved in the rearing of children and just didn't know what to do, if they remarried the new wife might well turn the children of the earlier marriage out. They were very hard times.

Enviro, there are good and bad people everywhere in the world. Your ancester would have suffered the same fate in similar circumstances in most positions at that time.

Hope you are going to keep posting and give us any insights you have.

Slan
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Re: FAMILY RESEARCH RESULTS

Postby toreador » Fri Jun 24, 2011 9:39 pm

Hi there Samuel ,
Reading ur post here , I can relate to your situation . My Dad was born in Tram Cottages in Dalkey , his mother died when he was young ( 11yrs old) . There was 4 boys and 2 girls in the family , but their Father was not able to look after them properly and my dad started to mitch from school . Eventually he ended up in Carriglea Industrial School in 1925 and he was there till 1929 .He died in 1997 aged 84 . Amazingly , he told me that it was the best years of his life , because he learned how to play clarinet and saxophone, because they had a band there , much the same as the Artane Boys Band and went on to play in Dance bands around Dunlaoghaire and Dublin area . In 1962 he took me out to see what was left of the school, which was still open then , not closing down till 1970 I think . but , much to his surprise , we met the Brother that taught the boys in the Band . Even after all that time , 33years, my dad remembered him and they had a long chat . I think my Dad was one of the lucky ones . My memory of my Dad is that he was a very gentle and caring man . Just thought I would share this with you
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Re: FAMILY RESEARC H RESULTS

Postby Enviro500 » Sat Jun 25, 2011 10:49 am

Sinead,
Hi and nice to hear from you again, I totally concur with you regards the C.B.S Institutions. I went through their schooling system St Michaels Eblana from 1956 t0 1963.. I had a good grip of the "3 Rs" when I left.. but my proper education commenced at Dun Laoghaire Tech, same road.

The Clerics at St Michaels were fair some hard some soft but sadly the bullies were lay teachers and they were in the secondary secondary, names like lLofty Flynn and Duddy come to mind...Forever etched on my mind and an ongoing ear problem to this day. Damaged by the teacher with a large blackboard compass...Parents complained and were offered another year without BOOK paying,as compensation as you did then pre 1966 BEFORE free secondary schooling .Neddless to say my Mum dragged me away T.G..
Sinead, the sad thing is that as a result of that experience, to THIS DAY and I am 63 now, I want to go to that teachers house,knock on his door and bop him on the nose, yes hie is still alive though an old man by now .

The other 95 % of staff good people.. Still my great grandad lost his livelyhood for simply being a Good Samaritan..
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Re: FAMILY RESEARCH RESULTS

Postby samuel » Sat Jun 25, 2011 3:46 pm

toreador wrote:Hi there Samuel ,
Reading ur post here , I can relate to your situation . My Dad was born in Tram Cottages in Dalkey , his mother died when he was young ( 11yrs old) . There was 4 boys and 2 girls in the family , but their Father was not able to look after them properly and my dad started to mitch from school . Eventually he ended up in Carriglea Industrial School in 1925 and he was there till 1929 .He died in 1997 aged 84 . Amazingly , he told me that it was the best years of his life , because he learned how to play clarinet and saxophone, because they had a band there , much the same as the Artane Boys Band and went on to play in Dance bands around Dunlaoghaire and Dublin area . In 1962 he took me out to see what was left of the school, which was still open then , not closing down till 1970 I think . but , much to his surprise , we met the Brother that taught the boys in the Band . Even after all that time , 33years, my dad remembered him and they had a long chat . I think my Dad was one of the lucky ones . My memory of my Dad is that he was a very gentle and caring man . Just thought I would share this with you



Hi Toreador,
Good to read your post, it is quite amazing that your Dad would probably had been at the school when my father and uncle were there. If you read my first post you would see my uncle went onto be a muscian and piano tuner ,his bands were in Galway, if you google Gerry Macken or Des Fretwell Orchestra you can read a little about them, ironically, my Father was 84yrs when he passed away in 1995, he came over to England and joined the Dorchester Regiment in 1934 when he was 23yrs, I don't know to this day how he got to England,for I have been told he was sent to be a farm boy in Co Waterford when he was 16, I presume the school would have arranged this on his discharge.I think he then lost touch with his brother until the early 1990's when he had a phone call from him, he had 10 siblings altogether, and he only spoke about 3 of them.i have been researching my irish family, and approx 2 years ago I posted on the Cavan Roots website that I was searching for my family, they came from Cavan and Granard. Only 4 months ago I received an e-mail from a person in Dublin who had read my post, he was also looking for his family. I am still in shock as he was my cousin's son, and his grandmother was my father's youngest sister. We came across to Dublin 5 weeks ago and met them, and they really made us so welcome, and again what a coincidence as they live in TALLAGHT,and we stayed at the hotel opposite the football stadium in Tallaght.

Hope to speak with you again on this site.

Pat.
samuel
 

Re: FAMILY RESEARCH RESULTS

Postby Enviro500 » Sat Jun 25, 2011 8:55 pm

Samuel, Pat,
That is amazing, My late father in Law a dear pal too, joined the 2nd Batt Dorset Regiment in 1930 and was posted to the North West Frontier, now Pakistan and he was barracked near Peshawar on the Afghan Border...In 1937 he was transferred to Palestine, by then he was 25 years old. within two years he was further posted to Malta and was to spend the entire Siege there intil 1941.. then posted to the Desert Rats 8th Army went through to Sicily landed at Katania and then got Malaria, transferred to Hospital in Newcastle on Tyne. He stayed with the Dorsets until 1956 and was an explosives specialist, and career man finishing as a W.O.1....From the 1950s Bob was based and Dorshester Barracks in Blandford Forum.. Interesting, one of his corporals during North Africa was a guy from Dublin called Jimmy Redpath, and well decorated, he went on to become one of Barbara Hutton's (Woolworth Heiress) bodyguards in New York. Small world eh...perhaps they knew each other and we will never know

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Re: FAMILY RESEARCH RESULTS

Postby samuel » Sat Jun 25, 2011 10:22 pm

Enviro500 wrote:Samuel, Pat,
That is amazing, My late father in Law a dear pal too, joined the 2nd Batt Dorset Regiment in 1930 and was posted to the North West Frontier, now Pakistan and he was barracked near Peshawar on the Afghan Border...In 1937 he was transferred to Palestine, by then he was 25 years old. within two years he was further posted to Malta and was to spend the entire Siege there intil 1941.. then posted to the Desert Rats 8th Army went through to Sicily landed at Katania and then got Malaria, transferred to Hospital in Newcastle on Tyne. He stayed with the Dorsets until 1956 and was an explosives specialist, and career man finishing as a W.O.1....From the 1950s Bob was based and Dorshester Barracks in Blandford Forum.. Interesting, one of his corporals during North Africa was a guy from Dublin called Jimmy Redpath, and well decorated, he went on to become one of Barbara Hutton's (Woolworth Heiress) bodyguards in New York. Small world eh...perhaps they knew each other and we will never know

Enviro500


Hi Enviro,
What another coincidence, I have just checked my father's service book,it does not show which Batt. he was in,but he enlisted in August 1934 in London and shows his regiment as The Dorchester Regiment. He was Home from 1934-1936, He was then posted to India 3/2/36 until 16/6/39. His next posting was to Malta from 17/6/39 until 29/3/43.Then home until NWE 31/5/44 until 10/6/44. He was seriously injured at the D Day Landings in France, and was shipped back to England, his story was the first ship he was to go on was full, but it turned out that this ship was atacked and no one survived, He was given the last rights, but he was lucky enough to pull through. He was discharged as medically unfit in 1946.

It certainly looks like they may have known each other, but as you say, we will never know,

Pat.
samuel
 

Re: FAMILY RESEARCH RESULTS

Postby Enviro500 » Sat Jun 25, 2011 10:37 pm

Samuel,
Bob the Dad in Law, missed D-Day as stated, but correction, he also went to Malta in Summer 1939.....after Malta liberated he went to Benghazi, Tripoli, Sidi Birani etc in Libiya with Dorsets part of 8th Army ( Desert Rats), then to Sicily and eventualy to Blightey....Bob said that there was at least 40 'Free State' lads as he termed them, in Dorsetshire Bat t...That batallion is now called 'The Devon & Dorset Battalion'

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Re: FAMILY RESEARCH RESULTS

Postby toreador » Sun Jun 26, 2011 6:57 pm

samuel wrote:
toreador wrote:Hi there Samuel ,
Reading ur post here , I can relate to your situation . My Dad was born in Tram Cottages in Dalkey , his mother died when he was young ( 11yrs old) . There was 4 boys and 2 girls in the family , but their Father was not able to look after them properly and my dad started to mitch from school . Eventually he ended up in Carriglea Industrial School in 1925 and he was there till 1929 .He died in 1997 aged 84 . Amazingly , he told me that it was the best years of his life , because he learned how to play clarinet and saxophone, because they had a band there , much the same as the Artane Boys Band and went on to play in Dance bands around Dunlaoghaire and Dublin area . In 1962 he took me out to see what was left of the school, which was still open then , not closing down till 1970 I think . but , much to his surprise , we met the Brother that taught the boys in the Band . Even after all that time , 33years, my dad remembered him and they had a long chat . I think my Dad was one of the lucky ones . My memory of my Dad is that he was a very gentle and caring man . Just thought I would share this with you



Hi Toreador,
Good to read your post, it is quite amazing that your Dad would probably had been at the school when my father and uncle were there. If you read my first post you would see my uncle went onto be a muscian and piano tuner ,his bands were in Galway, if you google Gerry Macken or Des Fretwell Orchestra you can read a little about them, ironically, my Father was 84yrs when he passed away in 1995, he came over to England and joined the Dorchester Regiment in 1934 when he was 23yrs, I don't know to this day how he got to England,for I have been told he was sent to be a farm boy in Co Waterford when he was 16, I presume the school would have arranged this on his discharge.I think he then lost touch with his brother until the early 1990's when he had a phone call from him, he had 10 siblings altogether, and he only spoke about 3 of them.i have been researching my irish family, and approx 2 years ago I posted on the Cavan Roots website that I was searching for my family, they came from Cavan and Granard. Only 4 months ago I received an e-mail from a person in Dublin who had read my post, he was also looking for his family. I am still in shock as he was my cousin's son, and his grandmother was my father's youngest sister. We came across to Dublin 5 weeks ago and met them, and they really made us so welcome, and again what a coincidence as they live in TALLAGHT,and we stayed at the hotel opposite the football stadium in Tallaght.

Hope to speak with you again on this site.

Pat.
hi there ,
well well what do know ,Pat, that Hotel would have been the "Maldron", what part of Tallaght do those folks live . you know, it's amazing when u start looking for someone here , u never know what ur goin to find .Sometime after my Dad's mother died, his father put an advert in the paper for a woman to look after the family , whether he marrried her or not I dont know , but I remember my Dad telling me when he got his first job ..14s 3p she told him to keep the 3p, she needed the 14shillings . But he later became an electrician in the D.U.T.C ( Dublin United Tramway Company )in Dalkey Depot and when the trams were taken off the road he became a mechanic in C.I.E. in Ringsend Garage in 1945. The Family name is Halligan and most of the Halligan men worked on the Trams .
When I think back to all the boys that were in those Industrial schools andd how they survived , they were survivors of their time .. u say that u dont know how ur dad got to England.. but he did . I wish u all success
toreador
 

Re: FAMILY RESEARCH RESULTS

Postby samuel » Sun Jun 26, 2011 8:50 pm

Hi Toreador
Yes, it was the Maldron Hotel,had a senior moment, could not think of the name, my relatives live not far from the big shopping centre in Tallaght.
My husband and I are hoping to return to Dublin later in in the year, we hope to go to Co Longford, and Donegal, apparently my Grandfather was a Soldier and was at Clonmany Donegal in 1916/1917, and Enniskillen in 1919. HIs family came from the Granard area. I could find no details of him, so I paid a military researcher to do a search, but he could not come up with any information, I know a lot of records were lost in the big fire in Dublin, so possibly this is why, or the other reason is that he was probably still in the army in 1922, and those records are held in Scotland, will probably have to go that route, I can find no death record for him on the sites I use, but possibly when we come back to Dublin we can go to the GRO and search the records.

ENVIRO.
I forgot to say my Father went to Egypt for 6 months before being posted home before D Day, I apologise For the mistake in spelling last rights, it should have read rites, again blame this on tiredness. and a senior moment, Well thats my excuse.

Pat
samuel
 

Re: FAMILY RESEARCH RESULTS

Postby toreador » Mon Jun 27, 2011 12:08 am

samuel wrote:Hi Toreador
Yes, it was the Maldron Hotel,had a senior moment, could not think of the name, my relatives live not far from the big shopping centre in Tallaght.
My husband and I are hoping to return to Dublin later in in the year, we hope to go to Co Longford, and Donegal, apparently my Grandfather was a Soldier and was at Clonmany Donegal in 1916/1917, and Enniskillen in 1919. HIs family came from the Granard area. I could find no details of him, so I paid a military researcher to do a search, but he could not come up with any information, I know a lot of records were lost in the big fire in Dublin, so possibly this is why, or the other reason is that he was probably still in the army in 1922, and those records are held in Scotland, will probably have to go that route, I can find no death record for him on the sites I use, but possibly when we come back to Dublin we can go to the GRO and search the records.

ENVIRO.
I forgot to say my Father went to Egypt for 6 months before being posted home before D Day, I apologise For the mistake in spelling last rights, it should have read rites, again blame this on tiredness. and a senior moment, Well thats my excuse.

Pat



Hi Samuel ,
Have you tried the National Archives here in Bishop St Dublin It is a onsite facility open all day 10.00 till 17.00 01/4072300. http://www.nationalarchives.ie. They have genealogists there who will go through any info who have with you , free of charge . http://www.pilot.familysearch.com . http://www.nli.ie( in KIldare Street ...city center )01/6030200...best of luck

Dermot
toreador
 

Re: FAMILY RESEARCH RESULTS

Postby samuel » Mon Jun 27, 2011 8:29 pm

Hi Dermot,
Thanks for the info, I have already used the LDS pilot site and found quite a lot of information from there, I have also e-mailed the National Archives to see if they hold records for the Dublin Union in 1924, where my grandmother died, as yet they have not got back to me. Hopefully when we come back over to Ireland later this year, this will be one of our missions.

Will definately not give up.

Pat.
samuel
 


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